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PostPosted: Thu May 15, 2014 6:00 pm 
BUFF McWhalen
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Helios, your interpretation posts are always my favorite.

I agree with most of your last post. I'm still trying to put together my feelings on Shadow Man, but you're on the right track.

I don't think Gemini is crazy or has a split personality as the result of reprogramming. I think he actually has a twin, or was built with that second side from the get-go - with that being his whole power and all.

I'm leaning toward "the rat" not being A rat, in the traditional sense. In context it seems more likely that it's just being used simply as period-relevant slang for vermin.

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PostPosted: Fri May 16, 2014 12:54 am 
Scrap Metal
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yeah, im probably gonna have to listen to the album through a couple (dozen) more times to finalize any theories ive got though specifically right now im interpreting 'the rat' in GeminEye as being Gemini's clone/twin/alternate personality, and the gunshot being him shooting them

unrelated, but one of the things I cant quite figure out is; at what point exactly does Mega Man go from the kind of doom-and-gloom attitude of self-doubt and not being able to see the """light""" to his complete 180 in 'I Refuse (To Believe)' ? Maybe i'm missing something but i cant really seems to find a defined turning point?


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PostPosted: Fri May 16, 2014 2:45 am 
Telly
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roboreos wrote:
yeah, im probably gonna have to listen to the album through a couple (dozen) more times to finalize any theories ive got though specifically right now im interpreting 'the rat' in GeminEye as being Gemini's clone/twin/alternate personality, and the gunshot being him shooting them

unrelated, but one of the things I cant quite figure out is; at what point exactly does Mega Man go from the kind of doom-and-gloom attitude of self-doubt and not being able to see the """light""" to his complete 180 in 'I Refuse (To Believe)' ? Maybe i'm missing something but i cant really seems to find a defined turning point?


Look at what you've done/Wily STage 1

Wily accuses Mega of killing his brother with no regrets

The Message From DR.Light
Light tells Mega that the conscience he has is Rock's own, not something he programmed

History Repeating
Mega has self doubts of doing this once more, so he decides it's the last

I want to be (The One To Watch You DIe)
Light removes the three Robotic laws from Megas, so he can kill Wily

Continue
He has regrets, and even Despise for Light, but will do it, even though he now thinks Light is a coward

Fly On A Dog
He reproches Light's methods. Starts to blame him

I am not the Breakman
Realizes that Blues is Breakman.

Make Your Choice
Gamma Or Proto confronts Mega in to what he has to do: Kill or not kill DR.Wily

I Refuse (To Believe)
He says "fuck everyone" and does what is right by his own goddamned conscience


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PostPosted: Fri May 16, 2014 3:49 am 
Scrap Metal

Joined: Tue Dec 29, 2009 2:33 pm
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roboreos wrote:
unrelated, but one of the things I cant quite figure out is; at what point exactly does Mega Man go from the kind of doom-and-gloom attitude of self-doubt and not being able to see the """light""" to his complete 180 in 'I Refuse (To Believe)' ? Maybe i'm missing something but i cant really seems to find a defined turning point?


My personal take on it is that Snake Man and Light are responsible for really bringing those doubts out in Mega Man (Snake Man convincing Mega Man that's he's not much better than any Wily bot and Light telling Mega Man to go kill). Likewise, what gets Mega Man back on track is Shadow Man and Proto (Shadow Man giving a warning about what Mega Man will become if he follows this path, and Protoman inadvertently reminding him that only he gets to decide what he's going to do).


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PostPosted: Fri May 16, 2014 4:05 am 
Spare Nuts and Bolts
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roboreos wrote:
unrelated, but one of the things I cant quite figure out is; at what point exactly does Mega Man go from the kind of doom-and-gloom attitude of self-doubt and not being able to see the """light""" to his complete 180 in 'I Refuse (To Believe)' ? Maybe i'm missing something but i cant really seems to find a defined turning point?


I see it happening when he confronts Proto and Gamma. Proto's primarily motivated by his rage against Dr. Light for discarding him and replacing him, a rage that seems to be mirrored now in Dr. Light's order to kill Dr. Wily back in I Want To Be The One (To Watch You Die). Gamma, meanwhile, has made a very cold, analytical determination that as long as both humans and robots exist in the world, there will always be war. I Refuse (To Believe) really fits as a response to both of those views: Mega Man refuses to buy into either of their viewpoints, instead choosing a different path to believe in. I mean, you can see he's still not 100% certain of his choice as he argues with himself whether or not to kill Wily. It's a reaction to the other paths presented, and a choice to walk down a different one, but it's not an easy choice for him to make.


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PostPosted: Fri May 16, 2014 9:34 am 
Sniper Joe
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Good list Lime, but don't forget the Lamentations of a War Machine

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PostPosted: Sat May 17, 2014 2:52 pm 
Scrap Metal
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i think a lot also hinges on where you place Continue, chronologically. is it literally meant to be taking place between Mega taking out the first and second batch of robot masters, or (as seems more logical) is it his feelings after everything is over?


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PostPosted: Mon May 19, 2014 2:37 am 
Mettaur
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I'm sure I'm super late on this, but I would like to point out the thing between

(I Want to be The One) to Watch You Die
I Refuse (to Believe)

and how it connects into

(I Want to be The One to Believe)
I Refuse to Watch You Die

So yeah.


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PostPosted: Mon May 19, 2014 6:33 am 
* Fox
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MirbyStudios wrote:
I'm sure I'm super late on this, but I would like to point out the thing between

(I Want to be The One) to Watch You Die
I Refuse (to Believe)

and how it connects into

(I Want to be The One to Believe)
I Refuse to Watch You Die

So yeah.

Holy cow

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PostPosted: Mon May 19, 2014 7:58 am 
Ban Jay C
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MirbyStudios wrote:
I'm sure I'm super late on this, but I would like to point out the thing between

(I Want to be The One) to Watch You Die
I Refuse (to Believe)

and how it connects into

(I Want to be The One to Believe)
I Refuse to Watch You Die

So yeah.


this is more significant than literally every lyrics theory post in the last two weeks


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PostPosted: Mon May 19, 2014 1:16 pm 
Mettaur
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I think that (I Want to be The One to Believe) refers to Proto Man, who just wants to believe. And I Refuse to Watch You Die is Mega Man, who refuses to kill Wily, and watch him die. Or maybe to watch Proto Man die.

Honestly I wasn't sure which was which but some of y'all's theories here kinda helps to figure that out.


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PostPosted: Tue May 20, 2014 8:40 am 
* Fox
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MirbyStudios wrote:
I think that (I Want to be The One to Believe) refers to Proto Man, who just wants to believe. And I Refuse to Watch You Die is Mega Man, who refuses to kill Wily, and watch him die. Or maybe to watch Proto Man die.

Honestly I wasn't sure which was which but some of y'all's theories here kinda helps to figure that out.

You are a golden god, Mirby.

Hey. When did Greg say all the shirts and CDs are expected to ship? I don't think I can wait much longer without that 80's shirt.

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serea11 wrote:
So you have to ask from mother, "Who is my father?" And if she says, "This gentleman is your father," then it is all right. It is easy.


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PostPosted: Tue May 20, 2014 9:21 am 
Telly
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Posts: 147
MirbyStudios wrote:
I'm sure I'm super late on this, but I would like to point out the thing between

(I Want to be The One) to Watch You Die
I Refuse (to Believe)

and how it connects into

(I Want to be The One to Believe)
I Refuse to Watch You Die

So yeah.

I think I need to re-evaluate my life choices.


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PostPosted: Tue May 20, 2014 9:30 am 
Yellow Devil
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LockableFaceman wrote:
MirbyStudios wrote:
I think that (I Want to be The One to Believe) refers to Proto Man, who just wants to believe. And I Refuse to Watch You Die is Mega Man, who refuses to kill Wily, and watch him die. Or maybe to watch Proto Man die.

Honestly I wasn't sure which was which but some of y'all's theories here kinda helps to figure that out.

You are a golden god, Mirby.

Hey. When did Greg say all the shirts and CDs are expected to ship? I don't think I can wait much longer without that 80's shirt.


He mentioned something about it in another thread:

Gregatron wrote:
The CDs are officially in the pressing stage now, which takes about 2 weeks. Then figure at least a week for shipping to the distributor and for the distributor to get them into their system and whatnot - then they'll go to you guys! All told, my best guess is that people will start getting them the second week of June maybe?

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Last edited by The Violet Fox on Tue May 20, 2014 9:35 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Tue May 20, 2014 9:32 am 
* Fox
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I knew he said something but couldn't remember the thread. I am too lazy to snoop these days so I'm glad someone else had the power to.
Thank you.

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serea11 wrote:
So you have to ask from mother, "Who is my father?" And if she says, "This gentleman is your father," then it is all right. It is easy.


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